15,592. Have you applied for that?-There is a man here who has applied for it. I think he applied to Mr. Charles Duncan, writer, and also to the sheriff.
15,593. Who was the agent from whom you thought you should have got it?-Mr. Leask.
15,594. Did you apply to him for the difference which you ought to have got in consequence of being put upon short allowance?- Yes; and he told us it was no use applying for it, because he did not think we would get it. I never asked Mr. Leask about that myself, but other men in Lerwick have done it.
15,595. Did they mention to him that the Hull men had got the difference paid to them?-Yes.
15,596. Did Mr. Leask offer to do anything for you in that case?- Not as far as I know; but I was away from home at the time when the men applied for it.
15,597. Do you think that has anything to do with your dealings at Mr. Leask"s shop?-I don"t think so, but I suppose Mr. Leask could have applied for it if he had liked.
15,598. Had you an account with him that year which you settled as usual at the end of the season?-Yes.
15,599. Did you not apply for the difference on the short allowance when you were settling that account?-Yes. They told me then that they did not know but what they might get it for us, but still they did not say that we would get it, and it has not come yet.
Lerwick, January 30, 1872, WILLIAM LAURENSON, examined.
15,600. Are you a seaman living in Bressay?-Yes. I have been at the sealing and whaling for thirty-six years. I have got settled, and got my wages paid to me at the Custom House for some years back, but that was not done when I first went.
15,601. Before you were paid at the Custom House, did you not get payment of your wages?-I got no satisfaction of them. I very often did not see an account. I would come over from Bressay two or three different times wanting to get settled, but they would shove me off time after time, giving me perhaps 10s. or 1; but they would not settle with me.
15,602. Were you owing an account for supplies at that time?- I got supplies from the shop when I went on the voyage, but I always had balances of money to get. I never was in debt.
15,603. By what agents were you treated in that way?-They are long dead now.
15,604. Did that not continue till 1867, when the new regulations came into force, according to which you were paid at the Custom House?-Yes; the system continued much the same until then.
15,605. Were you put off in the same way from time to time down till 1867?-Yes; perhaps getting 1 or 10s. now and again.
15,606. What agents were you engaged by, five or six years ago?- I was engaged by Mr. Tait, and I was three years for Mr. Tulloch; but I was paid at the Custom House then.
15,607. Were you often engaged by Mr. Tait before 1867?-I would be engaged by him perhaps two years at a time, and then I would leave him and go to another, and then go back to him again.
15,608. Who else did you engage with?-I went out a long time for Messrs. Hay, and I was with Mr. Leask too.
15,609. When you went, until five years ago, to get a settlement of your account, were you always put off with 1 or 10s., or some supplies, if you wanted them?-I was put off now and again.
15,610. Did all the agents who employed you treat you in the same way?-Almost every one.
15,611. Did you not get a settlement with Messrs. Hay when you asked for it?-Yes; I got a fair settlement with Messrs. Hay when I went out from their shop.
15,612. Were you ever put off in the way you have mentioned when you were engaged by them?-No; and I was engaged by them for ten years.
15,613. When you went to Mr. Tait, did he settle with you when you asked for it, even before the new system?-Yes.
15,614. Did he ever put you off in that way?-No. I was out of his shop when his father was alive, and he settled with me in the same way.
15,615. Had you ever to ask him twice for your money?-No.
15,616. Did you get a settlement whenever you went there for it?-Yes.
15,617. Did you always get your money in full when you went over to ask for it from Mr. Leask?-I got what was due to me; but I generally had some things out of the shop before I went, and then I got the balance.
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15,618. Could you always get it at once without any difficulty?- Yes; I just asked for it and I got it.
15,619. Then who were the agents who put you off in the way you mentioned?-They are all dead long ago.
15,620. I thought you said the system of putting you off in that way, and of giving you 1 or 10s. at a time, continued till about five or six years ago?-Sometimes it did, and sometimes not.
Some years I never got a fair account, and in other years I did.
15,621. But you always got a fair account from Messrs. Hay?- Yes.
15,622. And from Mr. Leask?-Yes.
15,623. And from Mr. Tait and Mr. Tulloch?-Yes.
15,624. What agents were there besides these, five or six years ago?-It is far longer than five or six years since I was put off in that way, and did not get the settlement when I wanted it.
15,625. Will it be ten years since you asked for your money and did not get it?-It will be ten years, or above that.
15,626. Will it be fifteen or twenty years ago?-It will be from fifteen to twenty years.
15,627. Are you a harpooneer or a boat-steerer?-I am a boat-steerer.
15,628. Did you hear the evidence of Francis Gifford?-Yes.
15,629. Do you think he was generally correct in what he said?- Yes. I know quite well that men who were in debt to the agent could get a ship sooner than I could, who was clear with them.
15,630. Could a man do that although he was not so good a seaman?-Yes.
15,631. Was that a general belief among the men?-Yes. For my part, I never was indebted to any of the agents, and therefore I got a ship whenever wanted it.
15,632. Did you get a ship because you were not in debt?-Yes; it did not matter. I stayed in one ship for a long time.
15,633. Were the agents more willing to get a berth for a man who was not in their debt?-No.
15,634. Did they prefer to engage a man who was in their debt?- Yes; but there were not very many that would be in debt. Perhaps a young hand, who had been a year or two only at the whaling, and had small wages, would be in debt, and they would take him next year in order to clear off the accounts which he had left the year before.
15,635. Do you think the green hands were ready to get into debt in order to make sure of getting a berth next year?-I don"t know about that.
15,636. Then what did you mean by saying that you never were in debt, and therefore you always got berth when you wanted it?-I only meant to say that always got a ship when I wanted one, but that I never was in debt to the agents; and therefore I cannot prove whether they would take me more readily if I was in debt. But I have heard the men saying that those who were in debt would be shipped as soon as the others.
Lerwick, January 30, 1872, ELIZABETH MORRISON, examined.
15,637. Do you live in Lerwick?-Yes.