11,942. Do the other people on Mr. Bruce"s estate who fish for you, and whose rent you pay, deal entirely in your shop for their supplies?-I think the most part of them do.
11,943. Is that one reason why you pay their rents for them?-I suppose so.
11,944. Do you find that these men are generally in your debt at settlement?-Only some of them. There are some of the men who have always plenty of money to get, but there are others who have commonly been behind.
11,945. Are more than one half of them commonly behind?-No.
There are more than one half of them who always have money to get.
11,946. Still there are some of them who are usually a good bit behind?-Yes; but I hope they will get and be able to pay it off.
Some of them are men whose [Page 294] sons are willing now to pay for their fathers, and it is a great matter to see that.
11,947. The debts you refer to have been incurred for supplies of hooks and lines, and meal and other things required for the family?-Yes; chiefly for meal. Of course, they get hooks and lines also but they require a great deal of bread and meal.
11,948. Do those men who fish for you own their own boats, or do the boats belong to you?-The boats are all their own.
11,949. Are you not a boat-owner?-Not with these men.
11,950. Have you some boats here?-Yes; I had too many, and got very little profit from them.
11,951. The boats you had at Scalloway were hired out by you?- Yes; it got the name of hire, but I never received it. The nominal hire is 5s. per man. If it carries three men it is 15s. and if four men, 1. That is for three or four months in the year.
11,952. These are small boats?-Yes.
11,953. Is that the kind of boat that is commonly in use in Scalloway?-Yes.
11,954. Are there none of the six-oared boats in use here?-There are none in use here just now. Even in summer it is the small boats that are used here. They fish near the sh.o.r.e and the small boats are more handy than the big ones.
11,955. Then there is no haaf fishing from Scalloway?-No.
11,956. Are all the fish that you cure, the produce of that insh.o.r.e fishing?-No; I have vessels that go to Faroe.
11,957. But you have no deep-sea fishing for ling?-No. I should not say that I never get the hire, because in some few cases I have got a little for it.
11,958. Then is it the case that you must look to the profit you make from the fish for the only remuneration you get for the use of these boats?-It would have been better for me if I had bought few or no fish in Scalloway, because the people here cannot get so much as will keep them alive. As has already been stated, the men in Scalloway are old men, who are not able to fish much.
11,959. How many tons of fish did you sell from that part of your fishing last year?-I am not able to answer that exactly just now, but there are commonly from 20 to 25 tons that come from Dunrossness.
11,960. And as much from Scalloway?-No; all that are got here is a mere trifle, and then we buy some in winter and spring from different quarters.
11,961. Do you also buy some in summer from other places too?- A few lots, not much.
11,962. Do the Burra men come and sell you a few lots in summer?-As little as possible.
11,963. Do you not like to buy from them?-I don"t like to see men leaving their masters. My men might do the same.
11,964. I suppose your men do sell to other people"s factors occasionally?-I don"t think there are many men among them who don"t do that.
11,965. Is it when they want a little ready money that they do that?-They can get it from me when they ask for it.
11,966. Perhaps, if a man is a little in your debt, he will not care to come and ask you for ready money?-There are men who are due me 5 and 10 and 15, and I just pay him for his fish over the counter when he brings them.
11,967. That is for the winter and spring fishing?-Yes. I would be happy if he could make as much from his fish as would keep him alive, but the worst of it is that these men cannot do that.
11,968. When you pay them money over the counter for their fish, do they generally pay some of it over the counter for supplies?- Yes; if they can buy articles as cheap from me as from another, they always do that. I have seldom seen them do anything else; but if they want a little money for any particular purpose, they can get it for that purpose.
11,969. They may need it for rent, and they will perhaps take it away to pay to their landlord?-That is not very often the case. If they have a house from another proprietor I very often have to pay the rent for them.
11,970. Do you lay out a good deal of money in that way?-Rather too much.
11,971. Do you sometimes pay other debts that are due by the men as well as their rent?-I suppose most of their debts are with me, except their rents.
11,972. Therefore most of their money matters are transacted through you?-I think so.
11,973. In fact, you are a sort of banker for the place?-I don"t know that; it is very little that I get to bank.
11,974. When a man is well to do and has a balance to receive, does he sometimes leave it in your hands?-If they thought I was ill off for money they would do that. One year I lost about 200 on the price of ling, and rather than see me ill off for money one and another of them who had money came and offered it to me.
11,975. Do you mean that they left what was due to them on their fishing in your hands?-Yes; and they offered me besides money which they had laid up in former years, if it could do me any good and keep me going on.
11,976. Do you not think the men would be much wiser to take their own money and spend it as they wanted? Would they not understand the value of the money better in that way, and take better care of it?-They take their money at the end of every season.
11,977. But in the meantime they have spent perhaps three-fourths or four-fifths of all their earnings?-Of course they have been lifting their lines and hooks and everything of that sort, but they have never wanted money when they asked for it, even although they had nothing in my hands. Sometimes they asked for it to buy a cow or some particular thing, and they sometimes got as much from me as 4 or 5.
11,978. But you don"t give it to them unless they want something particular, and mention to you what it is?-No.
11,979. Do you think it is a good system for men to leave all their affairs in your hands?-I don"t know; I did not want them to do so unless they liked.
11,980. Would not the merchant require to be a very honest man when he is so much trusted?-He would indeed.
11,981. And a man who was disposed to deceive the fishermen who trusted him would have very ample opportunities to do so?- He would.
11,982. I suppose that has been done in a few exceptional cases in Shetland?-No doubt it has.
11,983. Do you think a fisherman who lives under that system is an independent person?-A man who has plenty of money to serve his purpose is as independent a man, or he should be, as any.
11,984. Do you think the fishermen have plenty of money to serve their purposes?-Not in general; but there are a few who have it.
11,985. Do you think they might all have it?-I don"t think so.
11,986. Is that owing to bad seasons, or owing to a bad system, or what?-It is sometimes owing to all these things together.
11,987. I suppose all the men you employ, and some others besides, keep accounts in your books for the supplies which they require for their families and for the fishing?-Yes.
11,988. Each man has a ledger account?-Yes.
11,989. And although you are out of the business, you are still intimately acquainted with the way in which it is conducted?- Yes.
11,990. Do you think that one half of the men at this settlement have a balance to get in money?-I think most of the ling fishermen had, but the cod fishermen were much more in debt.