5677. Are these all employed in the summer fishing?-Yes.
5678. Is there any reason why the whole price of a man"s fish should not be paid to him in money?-The only reason is that he has already got part of it in goods. Of course we cannot pay for it in goods and in cash also.
5679. But is there any reason why he should take it in goods unless he likes?-None whatever, unless he likes. There is no compulsion put upon any of the men.
5680. Don"t you think he would be better off if he got the money, and paid for the goods in cash as he wanted them?-It is quite possible that he might fancy so; but I cannot see that it would make much difference. We always deduct the 5 per cent. from the goods the men have got, the same as if they were purchasing them for cash.
5681. So that you make no difference between cash payments, and paying for them in account in that way?-None in that respect.
5682. Why is it that you give that amount back in the form of a discount, instead of charging your goods originally at the same price?-Of course if a man buys a quarter of a pound of tea, or half a pound of tobacco we cannot take a discount off that; but we put the whole of the transactions together at the end of the season, and a discount is then allowed. If he bought the whole over the counter, he would pay the price down at once; but he has an advantage by these small items being added together, and the discount taken off, which he would not have if he paid for the articles separately.
5683. So that you really give a larger discount upon your credit dealings than, upon your cash dealings?-Yes; the fisherman has a greater advantage by having a discount upon these small purchases when they are all taken together, than he would have if he were paying for them separately. The discount upon two ounces of tobacco or a quarter pound of tea would be a mere bagatelle; but when the whole of his purchases [Page 141] in the course of the year are added together and the 5 per cent. taken off the whole, it comes to something. With our fishermen, as a rule, I consider that these accounts are perfectly good, and the same as if a man were purchasing for cash.
5684. What do you mean by saying that they are perfectly good?- I believe we are safe in making these advances to the men.
5685. That is because you have a security?-We have no security.
5686. Have you not the security of the fish?-Yes, we have that security, if he catches the fish.
5687. Is it upon that principle that you fix the prices at which you sell your shop goods?-Yes, generally. Of course, if we calculated upon it being really a bad account, we would require to charge larger percentage in order to cover the risk; but we would rather get clear of a man of that kind.
5688. Do you mean that, when a man is an unsafe customer, you put a different price on the goods which he buys?-I don"t put a different price on them; but I try to give him as little as I can, although there are some of these men whom it is very troublesome to put off without giving them something.,
5689. Is there a compet.i.tion for employment among the men to be taken on as fishermen for the summer season?-Yes, considerable.
5690. Are there men sufficient to man any number of boats you wish?-Well, I might be too greedy, wish more than I could manage; but I have found no difficulty hitherto in manning as many boats as we could reasonably manage.
5691. You supply your men with groceries as well as soft goods?-Yes; groceries, soft goods, and meal.
5692. In fixing the prices of these goods, both the groceries and soft goods, do you allow it margin for profit, just the same as any merchant would do in Lerwick, or Wick, or any other town?-I should fancy it is much the same. Of course, groceries being an article of daily use, we charge a less percentage on them than we do on soft goods. Very often soft goods lie on our shelves for a considerable time, and get damaged, and become unsaleable.
5693. But I suppose that would be the principle on which the retail price would be fixed if you deal in only one kind of these articles, or if you were selling them in any other place than Shetland?-Of course; that is the principle on which business is conducted anywhere. I think that goods, for instance soft goods, are sold by us in retail fully as low as they are in the shops in the south; even as cheap as they are retailed in Edinburgh. That is easily accounted for; because they have much larger rents to pay in Edinburgh than we have here.
5694. Do you say the same with regard to provisions?-I think there is not much difference on provisions; only the difference for freight and insurance. Of course, at a place like Voe, the transport of bulky goods comes to be very expensive. For instance, at this season of the year, we cannot get a sack of meal from Aberdeen to my house under 5s.
5695. The meal generally is imported about the end the season?- Yes, generally.
5696. Did you hear the evidence that was given today by some of the witnesses about the price of meal?-Yes.
5697. Are you in a position to say whether the price of meal at Voe is higher than at Lerwick, or about the same?-It is higher than at Lerwick as a matter of course, because we have considerable more expense in bringing it here. We have to bring it up to Brae by water, then cart it across the isthmus, and bring it to my house in boats. When the weather is bad, we have to cart it all the way.
5698. Therefore the price of meal with you is considerably higher?-Yes; and of any bulky article which requires a considerable deal of handling and expense of transport.
5699. What do you suppose the difference is between the price of meal at Voe and the price at Lerwick?-I should fancy about 2s.
per boll
5700. Will the difference be that throughout the year?-I think so; but sometimes in the spring we manage to get a vessel to bring it in direct; and then we can sell it as cheap as they do at Lerwick.
5701. Have your men ever made any complaint to you about the price being higher than it ought to be?-No.
5702. Is the price stated to them at the time when they get the meal, or is it generally fixed at settling time?-They know the price of every article when they buy it
5703. Do you calculate that the profit upon your provisions and soft goods, or the profit upon your fish sales, is the greater?-I cannot say.
5704. Have you the same percentage of profit upon both?-No; on the fish sales it is only 5 per cent.
5705. Is that just a commission?-Yes.
5706. That is to say, the payment to the men for the fish, the cost of fitting them out when you do so, and of your curing establishments, will come up to within 5 per cent. of what you sell them for to your buyers in the south?-Yes; and then we have to run the risk of the payments. The fish are all sold on three months bill. Our fishermen are all settled with this year, and I have not touched a sixpence for any of our fish yet.
5707. Does the 5 per cent. cover that risk?-Yes. Of course, if we discounted these bills, that would run off with 11/4 per cent. of it, but we just wait until the bills are due.
5708. Then, if you were under the necessity of paying your fishermen entirely in cash, and did not carry on your shop business, would you be obliged to charge a higher profit upon your fish, or to pay the fishermen less for the fish?-If I had no shop at all, and merely traded in fish, I would require to deal more in them than I do, in order to make a living out of it.
5709. But you can afford to take a smaller commission on your fish than you would otherwise do, by reason of the fact that you are carrying on another business at the same time?-Yes.
5710. You are making two profits, although one of them may be a very small one?-The one profit is entirely at the option of the fisherman. He is not obliged to buy the goods unless he chooses.
5711. Perhaps not, but he would likely require to pay that profit to another merchant, or certainly to pay some profit, and you would expect some of that to come to you?-Yes; every one expects some profit. I employ a good many hands about Voe curing fish.
These are invariably settled with in cash, if they are able to do without any supplies during the week, but they are always settled with at the end of the week.
5712. Theirs is a weekly payment?-Yes.
5713. But they get supplies during the week?-Sometimes we are obliged to give them something, otherwise they could not work.
5714. And that is deducted from their weekly pay?-Yes. At the stations the curers are generally engaged at a sum for the season.
5715. In what form are the supplies given at your shop deducted from the weekly payments at Voe?-For instance, if the girls working at the fish have earned 5s. a week, and if they have got 2s.
worth of goods, they have only 3s. to get.,
5716. But in what way is it noted that they have got that advance in goods?-We keep an account of it in our book.
5717. Is there a ledger account for each worker?-We have what we term a jot ledger for these weekly accounts. We do not carry them into our regular working books.
5718. How many people are employed in that way?-I have known as high as sixty; they will run from thirty to sixty.
5719. Do those people ever ask you for cash in the course of the week?-Sometimes they do but not very often. The length of time between the pays is so very short that they don"t require it, but if they are in need of cash they get it.
5720. Do they prefer to take their advances in goods?-They prefer to take their payment at the end of the week.
[Page 142]
5721. But when they require goods in the course the week, do you give them to them?-Yes; goods and cash are much the same thing to them; for if we gave them money, they would just turn round and buy the goods. If they went anywhere else, they must lose a day"s work in going to it.
5722. I suppose that is one reason why the system of fish-curers having stores for shop goods exists, because their shops are at such inconvenient distances from each other?-Yes; the people would lose so much time in travelling to other places in order to get their goods, that we require to keep shops for them. If their time is of any value to them at all, the fact that they have a shop on the spot far more than compensates them for any difference they may pay in price.
5723. But if there were no such shops as yours, would there not be a cla.s.s of dealers throughout the island who would provide the goods that the people want?-I don"t know; perhaps there might be such.